Are you excited to create marketing and brand content for your photography business? If you’re saying to yourself, “Uuuhh, no. Not really…” You’re not the only one.
Creating the content to market our business when we really just want to create artwork for our clients can feel like such a chore. And that’s where Tania comes in.
In this episode, Tania Barbieri is sharing her wisdom on how we can build photography brands that we’re actually excited to show up for and how we can create messaging and content for that brand that showcases our unique perspective. Plus, she’s sharing how to prioritize and systematize content so that it can actually fit into our lives and business.
The way that Tania reframes brand-building and how we can connect with potential clients is truly inspirational. Let’s dive in!
What’s in this episode:
- [02:00] What Tania has learned about creativity in each chapter of her career and how she landed in her current niche
- [07:44] How Tania helps photographers build a brand they want to show up for
- [10:58] How to keep going when your brand content isn’t landing how you hoped
- [15:23] Mistakes that photographers are making with their content and messaging
- [23:50] Tania’s advice for photographers who struggle to see their own magic
- [27:37] How to create sustainable systems for content creation that fit into their lives and business
- [35:03] The aha moment for photographers when they work with Tania
- [41:25] Tania’s Lightning round
If you’re ready to learn more about yourself to build a photography brand that truly excites you, this episode with Tania is one you can’t miss!
SUBSCRIBE: Apple Podcasts | Spotify
Meet Tania Barbieri
Tania is an ex primary school teacher turned portrait photographer, who ended up falling so in love with nailing the marketing side of running my business that she created Soulful Story Co. which helps photographers build out their brand, curate a profitable offer ecosystem, and create content marketing & copy that builds an invested community of raving fans.
Connect with Tania
Follow Soulful Story Co on Facebook
Follow Soulful Story Co on Instagram
Follow Soulful Story Co on Pinterest
Did this episode with Tania get you excited about your photography brand again? Check out this episode https://themilkyway.ca/play-prompts-and-passion-how-liz-devinny-creates-playful-photography-masterpieces/ that shares how another photographer started their career!
Transcript
[00:00:00] Lisa: Hey, friend. Welcome to the Art and Soul Show. I’m your host, Lisa DiGeso, a mom, a photographer and entrepreneur. Tune in here for Pep Talks, conversations and advice on photography, creativity, mindset, business, life, and that messy in between. This is the place where you can go when you need a boost of encouragement, a kick in the pants, and inspiration to pick up your camera.
[00:00:56] This is the Art and Soul show. Hello, my [00:01:00] beautiful friends. Welcome back to the show today. I’m excited to dive into today’s conversation with Tania Barbieri. I am so excited because she’s been on my wishlist for guests probably for the last few months. So I’m very, very excited to have her join on the show, talking about branding and social and all things social media.
[00:01:18] Now she’s an ex primary school teacher turned portrait photographer who discovered her real superpower wasn’t just behind the camera. But behind the brand, Tania’s the founder of Soulful Story Company where she helps photographers build brands they’re actually excited to show up for without the overwhelm from crafting irresistible offers to writing copy that connects Tania, brings a clear action focused approach to marketing that fits beautifully into real life.
[00:01:44] Yes, even the chaotic coffee fueled kind. Welcome, Tania. Thank you so much, Lisa. It’s lovely to be here. Now you have made some major pivots from teaching to photography to running soulful story co. What did [00:02:00] each chapter teach you about creativity and business?
[00:02:04] Tania: Yeah, so I think the teaching career definitely has given me the ability to be able to break things down.
[00:02:13] Explain things in a way that is really actionable in a way that people understand and then they can apply it to their business. So the two go hand in hand really well, as it turns out, and the business pivots, the business chapters have taught me that there’s a lot more to it than I think is out there on the surface level of what it takes to actually.
[00:02:40] Grow a business. Um, it’s easy to start one I feel, but growing it is a completely different thing and it takes a lot more than just our creativity. To be able to do that effectively and keep our sanity.
[00:02:55] Lisa: Totally. You know, it’s so, ’cause I struggle with social media so much specifically for my [00:03:00] photography business ’cause I run two companies.
[00:03:02] Yeah. And there will go times where it’ll be a month, maybe two months, and I have not posted anything and it’s just like feeling of, I have work to share, but I don’t know what to say. Ah, yes. And I don’t know how to say it or I don’t know how to, how to like, ’cause I am a little bit sarcastic and a little goofy.
[00:03:20] But it’s like, I find that a lot of the things, and especially things that are created are a bit saccharine when it comes to. Quotes or things for social media or if you are looking at all these different systems that are created, they are built for not quite our industry or they don’t quite connect.
[00:03:38] They’re like business to business and not business to consumer. So I would love to talk a little bit about how you found this niche, because I know that you have a social media system that I have been like almost hitting by like a million times on, so I would love it if you share a little bit more about that.
[00:03:54] Tania: Yep. So I have a digital product, the social set, which is captions for [00:04:00] photographers. So that’s been out since towards the end of 2023 and it’s done really well. And, uh, exactly what you said, I think I. Well, I kept hearing so many times, I wanna show up, but I dunno what to say. I dunno what to say that’s gonna sound different to anyone else.
[00:04:18] Yeah, I dunno what to say that is actually gonna cut through all the noise and that people are gonna pay attention to. And I honestly feel like even more so now in 2025 compared to when that product first came out. I think even now people are finding social media in particular quite. A struggle, like it’s a jungle out there trying to get reach and engagement and all the things that we’re told that we need.
[00:04:44] So the, the social set was the beginning of all that. And it wasn’t just the captions, but it was teaching people. Really the beginnings of understanding how you can tweak those captions to make them your own and sound like your own brand voice and, and all those things. But [00:05:00] also helping people understand what their people want to hear about.
[00:05:07] Yeah. And what they will, the photographer would be excited to share. I think it’s gotta be that blend of both. It’s like you are excited and passionate to share. Something, but also your people really need or want to hear it right now.
[00:05:24] Lisa: I love that. I’ve been playing a little bit with chat GBT recently and like letting it get to know me and let, letting it get to know my snarky, my stories and working with it as a tool to help me uncover more about me in order to share and write.
[00:05:40] Instead of saying, okay, chat GBT, you write everything. It’s like, how about we use a tool, you come up with an idea and I will play with that idea. So do you find that that’s something that you are embracing a little bit more now too, or is that something that you’re. Not so sure about.
[00:05:54] Tania: Yeah. To be honest, when I came up with the idea of the social set, I thought, how on earth am I [00:06:00] gonna come up with over a hundred captions?
[00:06:02] Yeah, this is gonna take me months and months. And I started trying to get chat GBT to help. I knew good prompts to give it. I had all that information. I knew that it took a lot of, not. Always a lot, but it definitely takes tweaking. Yes. Like saying, okay, make it sound more like this, make it sound less like this.
[00:06:21] Don’t include these words. So there is definitely, yeah, like you were saying, it gets to know you how you wanna sound, but in the end, I ended up using my captions that I had used in my own photography business. Love it. Yeah. That worked. Yeah. I was like, I actually have years worth of captions already sitting there.
[00:06:40] Captions that got engagement, that got bookings. Why on Earth am I trying to get it from any other place? But I do definitely use chat GBT and Claude as well. Claude is a, oh yeah, a really good alternative to help me with things like probably more [00:07:00] so Can you help me come up with a heading for a meta ad, or can you help me come up with, I wanna say this in my website copy, but I don’t wanna say it like this.
[00:07:10] I want it to sound more like this. So. Kind of helping with the excavation process. Yeah. Rather than spitting out the final product.
[00:07:18] Lisa: I love that because that’s one thing that I’ve been really working on is how to ask or give it better info and how to ask better questions in order and ask it. What do you need to get to know me better in order for you to give me the what I’m looking for?
[00:07:31] And it’s interesting because we kind of go into it expecting it to be just like working right outta the box and you’re like, Nope, this is customizable just for you.
[00:07:40] Tania: Yeah. Yes, exactly. That’s the way to look at it for sure. Yeah.
[00:07:44] Lisa: Yeah, so fun. So you specialize in helping photographers build a brand they want to show up for, for, so what does that actually mean in practice for you?
[00:07:54] Tania: Yeah, so it means I’ve worked with so many photographers now and I find that the common [00:08:00] thread I. Sometimes they don’t even realize it is that they are hiding behind their work, their art in some way. Whether it is literally ghosting their brand, ghosting their audience. I’ve been there too. Don’t worry multiple times or whether they are doing all the things that they feel like they should be doing and saying, but there’s still like this wall that they’ve put up between.
[00:08:29] What they think they should sound like and what they actually like. Who they actually are. Yeah. And I feel like they’re holding themselves back a lot, and that naturally doesn’t make it very exciting to show up because Yeah, you, you feel like you’re, if you say the things, you’re saying the wrong things, it’s not gonna work.
[00:08:48] No one’s listening, no one’s paying attention. And when you don’t get that feedback from people, because it should be. Like a two-way conversation because you’re building a community When you don’t [00:09:00] get that feedback. It’s just like, well, why bother?
[00:09:02] Lisa: Totally.
[00:09:03] Tania: So building a brand that you’re excited to show up for is committing to leading that brand is the biggest thing.
[00:09:09] Committing to being the front person of that brand and doing that through understanding. I think such a huge part of it is your words. Knowing what you want to say, knowing how you stand out amongst everybody else, knowing why someone would choose you over all of the other photographers in town. Knowing what makes your offer irresistible, knowing what that gap is between where your ideal client is now and where they wanna be, who they wanna be after working with you, all that kind of stuff.
[00:09:42] Once you know that, you suddenly have the confidence. To show up for your brand because you know what you wanna say. Mm-hmm. You know who you’re talking to, you know what you can say that will feel really good for you, but will also resonate with them.
[00:09:57] Lisa: I love that. I did a, a bit of [00:10:00] an experiment this past November and I did, I, I had ghosted my feed for like, oh gosh.
[00:10:06] Maybe a year. Yeah. And I was like, okay, I’ve been sitting around, you know, 2,500 fans. Let’s just do a 30 day challenge. I’m gonna either post a story or I’m gonna post a post every day for 30 days and see what happens. And I lost 25 people.
[00:10:25] Tania: I love that,
[00:10:27] Lisa: but I actually booked a few sessions. I had some, some old clients reach out and it kind of just got me in a creativity habit. Mm-hmm. And even though like it was, it was sometimes soul sucking, to be completely honest, because you’d post something and there would be no likes and you’d lose three people and you’re just like, why am I here?
[00:10:49] So it’s hard. It’s like what advice do you have on those days that you don’t wanna keep going, even though you know, you’ve committed to say a 30 day thing or what you’re doing isn’t quite working.
[00:10:58] Tania: Yeah, it’s [00:11:00] disheartening for sure. And on the outside I would definitely say have more like put more of your marketing eggs in different baskets, not just social media.
[00:11:09] Absolutely. Which you obviously know you have a podcast, so. But yeah, it’s, it is really, and I, I’ll sound like I’m repeating myself, but it is really, it comes down to reconnecting first with yourself, which sounds cliche, but reconnecting with what you are here to say. I find that a lot of the stuff that we are taught is very.
[00:11:35] It gives us very surface level answers. Yeah. Like we’re told to fill out a client avatar and we’re told that we’ve gotta find out what car that do they drive, where do they buy their toilet paper, like how much money do they earn and all that kind of stuff. But that doesn’t tell you how to communicate, like how do you actually continue the [00:12:00] conversation that she’s already having in her head.
[00:12:02] Like if your client’s a, a mom, like. When she’s lying awake at 3:00 AM what is she thinking about? What’s keeping her awake? Mm-hmm. And those kind of things likely have nothing to do with photography. Yeah. At all. Not directly. So it’s about getting so, so, so much deeper and really getting to the heart of what they wanna hear from you.
[00:12:25] And it’s very likely not. Like how to get more natural smiles out of your kids when you take photos. That’s that’s our kind of stuff of sandwiches. Yeah, that kind of stuff is fine, but you need to have the other stuff too. You need to have the stuff where you say, this is the hill I will die on. This is what I disagree with in this industry.
[00:12:48] This is what should be done differently and here’s how it helps you. And then you get that spark back and it’s like. Oh, I have things to say. Yeah, I have important things to say [00:13:00] that matter to my people. And even if you don’t get the likes and, and all that kind of stuff, like I have learned time and time and time again.
[00:13:08] The people that contact me so often are people I’ve never had a conversation with before. They are listening. They are listening. They may not be clicking the heartbeat button. They may not be DMing you from your stories. But they are there. They absolutely are. Like, so often I will get an email from someone who I’ve never heard of before and they’re like, I love what you do.
[00:13:30] And it’s like, wow, who are you?
[00:13:32] So
[00:13:34] Tania: yeah, but just really getting to the heart of. What’s gonna really pump you up? Because if you are out there trying to say what you think you should be saying and all the generic stuff, and we’ve gotta educate, inspire, entertain all those typical content pillars or content buckets, rather than ha thinking, what are the conversations I want to lead?
[00:13:58] Yeah. Like you are leading your [00:14:00] brand, your community needs a leader. And they wanna have a conversation with you. So what are
[00:14:06] Lisa: those conversations? I love that. And it’s, and it’s funny because like I’m a newborn photographer, but I am deep in the teenage trenches right now, and it is the wild west of parenting.
[00:14:17] Yeah. And I’ve been trying to share a little bit more about. My life and what’s happening there and just reflecting on the newborn stage is so precious because you don’t realize you’re getting a 15-year-old when they hand you that little baby. So
[00:14:32] Tania: yeah. I’m with you there. I’ve got a 14-year-old and a 12-year-old,
[00:14:39] Lisa: so there, there’s a reason.
[00:14:40] They are tiny and cute.
[00:14:42] Tania: Yeah.
[00:14:46] Absolutely. Yeah. I love it. I love it. Yeah. Even with that, I, I do hear that a lot. It’s like, well, I’m, I’m no longer at that stage, but how do I speak to those clients that are at a different stage to me, and I say [00:15:00] so often, for example, that’s a great example for say a maternity newborn family photographer.
[00:15:06] It’s like you are speaking to the same person. She’s just at a different stage of that journey. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
[00:15:13] Lisa: Oh, I love that. That’s a great, that’s a great reframe because I think that’s, yeah, we feel like we can’t relate because we’re not at the same, but you know, it’s just the same person just at a different stage.
[00:15:23] I love that. That’s great. Yeah. Yep. That, so what are some mistakes that you often see beyond being generic? Really, that photographers make a lot with their content and their messaging.
[00:15:35] Tania: Yeah. I feel like they don’t know how to get clear on, say. I like to say like the three to five key brand messages that they have, the key messages that are high level kind of the messages that really represent the hill, they’ll die on what they really think, what their perspective is that also relates to their people.
[00:15:59] [00:16:00] And they kind of, when you, once you get those messages laid. Down, you can rinse and repeat them. They become things that you are known for,
[00:16:11] right? Like
[00:16:12] Tania: the conversa, again, the conversations you want to lead, that’s what your messages essentially are like. I think that I talk about quite often is how we are perfectly capable of setting our own benchmarks.
[00:16:24] You don’t have to have a six figure, seven figure, eight figure business. Absolutely. Completely up to you. You know, we, you don’t have to follow. There is no one size fits all plan that fits everyone. And uh, going back to what you said earlier about how a lot of the stuff out there is very much for business to business, marketing and selling kind of scenarios, online business and not so much service like a local service provider business.
[00:16:52] So getting those key messages down is one of the. I think the biggest mistakes because once [00:17:00] you figure that out, you can, like, if you imagine those key messages are an umbrella, and underneath that umbrella are a bunch of different other things that you can talk about that relate that come back to those key messages, like for that six figure business key message of mine.
[00:17:17] Underneath that, I could talk about how, you know, if you wanna have a life, if you’ve got a family and all those kind of things. Thinking that you need to do exactly what a bro marketer with no family is doing. Not to be offensive to bro marketers, but
[00:17:34] Lisa: it’s okay. We’re team. We’re team. No, bro, it’s totally my, my
[00:17:37] Tania: goodness thinking that you need to be everywhere and you need to be hustling 24 7.
[00:17:44] And you’re like, but when do I actually be a mom? Like when do I have my life? Yeah. So that would be other things that I could talk about underneath that bigger umbrella of you get to, you get to set your own benchmarks, you get to decide how you do [00:18:00] things. And yeah. Things like that.
[00:18:02] Lisa: I love that. And I think it’s really, it’s really important and it’s not talked enough, enough in our industry is a defining your term of what success is for you.
[00:18:10] Oh, yeah. ’cause success for me may only be like three or four clients a month. And to someone else they’re having, they want 20 clients a month. And that’s success. Like, and we can have very different price points. And so it’s just, it’s so subjective, you know? Oh yeah. When we don’t discern. For our own success and what success feels like in our bodies.
[00:18:30] We’re just chasing someone else’s dream. And that’s silly. Absolutely silly.
[00:18:35] Tania: Don’t do that. There’s so much nuance to it that can’t be addressed in a one size fits all funnel or whatever is that’s getting. Touted out there as the thing, the silver bullet, that will work for everybody. No matter your target market, no matter your location, no matter your life context, no matter your capacity, no matter, you know, your availability no matter [00:19:00] what you’ve got on, off on, no matter your genre.
[00:19:01] Like
[00:19:02] Lisa: yeah, it’s wild. ’cause we’ve done, we’ve, you know, we’ve been in in online business for almost 14 years now, and so we’ve followed a lot of these. Entrepreneurs and bro marketers and sign up for masterminds. And there’s been so many times that we’re just like, we are at the wrong prom. Weird. Like, this is not our people.
[00:19:22] These, these are not how we need to talk to our audience. This is not how we connect with our audience. And I think coming from that point where you’re able to start discern what your audience. Needs from you and, and how you need to connect with them is so powerful. Oh yeah. And we don’t, you know, and we just assume everybody else has the magic answer and we wanna outsource that.
[00:19:44] Tania: Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. Because that’s what’s marketed to us that they do have the magic answer. Yeah. And
[00:19:52] Lisa: then when it doesn’t work for you, you’re like, oh, there’s something wrong with me and my business. Exactly. There’s not, there’s not.
[00:19:57] Tania: Exactly. Yeah. Us humans, we [00:20:00] love to attach. Meaning to things. It’s like.
[00:20:04] You know, if you reply to someone’s inquiry and they don’t get back to you, it’s like, well, what does that mean about me? Yes. What does that mean about my work? Yeah. They must have decided that they actually hate my work or they hate me,
[00:20:16] Lisa: or I know. And a lot of times they didn’t even get your response ’cause it went to spam or trash or like.
[00:20:22] Like it has nothing to do with you. Like, yeah, yeah. No, it’s wild. Our brains just take us on these crazy journeys telling us all these untrue stories. Yeah. And yeah, it’s wild. It’s wild out there and in there. Absolutely. So you’ve said that a lot of creatives lose their voice under a pile of shoulds comparison and self-doubt.
[00:20:46] So what advice do you have for helping them find it again?
[00:20:49] Tania: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Which ties in perfectly to what we’ve been saying and I think we need to give ourselves a lot more grace than what we do because especially in the earlier years, [00:21:00] we dunno what we’re doing. There’s no guidebook, there’s no kind of set recipe of what we should follow.
[00:21:08] Uh, that’s just not how it works. And of course, we kind of try on different personas. Maybe we, we look at what other people are doing and we think that looks like it’s working for them. Maybe it’ll work for me and we try out all these different things and maybe they work, maybe they don’t. But eventually I feel like we do get to a point where we, we do lean into our own voice, but we can forget, like I said before, we can forget that we do have things to say.
[00:21:38] Yeah, we do have things to say that matter. We do have things already inside us that sound different to everybody else. Because they’re coming from our perspective, our life experience, our yeah, learned experience, our critical thinking. So we kind of, we get [00:22:00] stuck in looking what everybody else is doing.
[00:22:01] And again, human behavior.
[00:22:03] Yeah,
[00:22:04] Tania: we wanna belong, we wanna get those likes, we want to succeed. We want it to, we want our businesses to grow. But yeah, eventually that stuff compile up the imposter syndrome. I actually dunno what I’m talking about. What am I doing here? And I think you’ve got to, again, commit to leading your brand, commit to saying, you know what?
[00:22:25] I’m gonna ask myself the right questions. Because that’s what it comes down to with your messaging. Especially asking yourself the right questions that will take you below surface level and get you excited about things again and realize that. You. Uh, and as cliche as it sounds like you truly are the difference.
[00:22:46] Yeah.
[00:22:47] Tania: You truly are the difference between everyone else in town, no matter what they’re doing. People will be drawn to you when you can lean into that. They will wanna check in on your [00:23:00] stories and see what you’re up to and see what you have to say, whether it’s the most seemingly mundane thing. But o so relatable.
[00:23:09] Mm-hmm. Or whether it’s like a perspective shifting chat that has some thinking. Where have you been? Or like, all my life, I love what you’re saying. Yeah. Just asking yourself the right questions. Finding out what that, what your brand vision is like, where are you going? And start, just start saying the things.
[00:23:31] Lisa: I love that. I think it’s That’s so true. It really resonated because I think a lot of the time we, we forget, we have our own little magic and then we shrink away and we forget because we, we just, we don’t look in the mirror and we’re just like, that’s me, that’s me, that’s me. But we forget that it’s something unique and special to someone else.
[00:23:50] And so what advice do you have for someone who maybe is struggling to see their own magic?
[00:23:55] Tania: I would give the advice of that. Yeah. [00:24:00] First of all, you’ve got to what, like what we were talking about before, you’ve gotta recognize those stories that you’re telling yourself. Yeah. In your own mind. Like really that is the stuff of sabotage right there.
[00:24:13] You know, telling yourself that you don’t know what you’re talking about, telling yourself that you’re not the expert and that you have to be the expert telling yourself that. You’re not cool enough or you’re not witty enough. Mm-hmm. Or you’re not young enough, or you’re not old enough, or you’re not experienced enough, or whatever it is.
[00:24:31] So yeah, I feel like getting in touch with that. Again, I’ll just tell a quick story, like in when I was deep in my photography business and I shared a story of my kids’ lunchbox at the end of the day, and it had this apple in it, and I said something like. Cheers to the apple. This apple that comes back every, it comes back home every single day.
[00:24:55] It never meets its fate. Nope. And that all of a [00:25:00] sudden, I was like, that’s one of the most DMed stories I had in my entire business. And I was like, what is going on? But I had people DMing me and saying, oh, that’s us. But in our house it’s a banana. And you know. So many people just, ah, I can so relate to that.
[00:25:20] And that’s what I mean, it’s just like, it’s not, it doesn’t have to be this complex kind of, how do I find my magic kind of thing. It’s seriously can be so simple as long as it’s relatable Yeah. To your people. That is, that if you can imagine a Venn diagram, it’s like this is all the stuff that matters to you and that you value and that.
[00:25:44] You find interesting and that you are passionate about and all those kind of things. And then you do the same for your ideal client and it’s the stuff that meets in the middle mm-hmm. That you are both passionate about, that you both value, that you both sigh over at the end of a long day [00:26:00] that you both find funny, like that you both feel vulnerable about.
[00:26:06] And that’s where the magic is when, ’cause I, like I said, it’s a two-way conversation. You’re building a community, not a following, it’s a community. So it’s like, Hey, I’m a real person. And we love to see that people are actually real people. We are nosy. Yes, we are curious. Oh my gosh. You wanna see what’s going on?
[00:26:25] Wanna,
[00:26:25] Lisa: I’m so nosy. Yes. But yet I will not let people in.
[00:26:31] Tania: Yeah. Kevin? No. Yeah. You can’t see the craps in my perfection. Yeah. Yeah. I heard something once that was like, you can be. Personal and still be private. Yeah, like something like that. Love that. Like you can still like, because a lot of people are like, I don’t want to show every minute of my day.
[00:26:51] And you absolutely don’t have to, but it’s like choosing those moments where you can kind of let people in. [00:27:00] Yeah. We, we love to feel like. We’re in a space where we belong. Like the person that’s leading that community gets us. And like we’re not just some random person in their audience. That’s what I hated about RIP Clubhouse, that people would be yes, up on the stage and everyone was down in the stands and that’s how some people would like, that was the words that they would use.
[00:27:25] And it’s like, that’s,
[00:27:26] Lisa: yeah.
[00:27:27] Tania: Ew.
[00:27:28] Lisa: That doesn’t
[00:27:28] Tania: feel good.
[00:27:29] Lisa: No, it doesn’t. No, it doesn’t feel collaborative at all. No. It feels like you’re being talked at versus talked to.
[00:27:37] Tania: Yeah,
[00:27:37] Lisa: totally. Alright, so let’s talk about being consistent with content. So how do you help people create sustainable systems that actually fit in their lives?
[00:27:50] Tania: Yeah, so I feel like, first of all, I ask people to at least. Decide on. ’cause if [00:28:00] you think of the, the marketing funnel, um, that we are taught, the sales funnel, the customer journey, the client journey. It’s very marketing speak, but it is the backbone of our business. It is how we get those new people in and how we build trust and how it leads to conversions eventually, like they’re booking in.
[00:28:20] So it’s like deciding on. One strategy for that top of funnel, that cold audience, like how are you gonna get in front of people? Or how are people gonna find you? Just at least one strategy there. One strategy for your warm audience. So the people that are already in your audience, they already are picking up what you’re putting down.
[00:28:40] But how can you nurture them further? And then you’ve got a strategy for the bottom of that funnel where you are increasing your, like thinking about how you can increase your conversions, basically, how can you increase your booking rate, how can you do that last, kind of help people to make that [00:29:00] decision, get them over the line if this is the right thing for them, kind of thing.
[00:29:03] So one strategy for each, because there are people in your audience that are at all those. Three stages, right? There’s people that are just found out about you and don’t have a clue about you. People that know you and people that are hot in marketing speak, um, people that are really, really thinking seriously about hitting that inquire button.
[00:29:25] So it’s like, I heard James Wedmore said this kind of analogy once and I kind of tweaked it to make it my own, but it was basically meet your people where they’re at. So if you imagine a river that’s flowing and that’s your audience, right? And they’re flowing and they’re going along and they’re living their lives and you set up shop on the river bank, but it’s like way back on the bank and you’ve got your megaphone and you’re going, Hey guys, come over here and see my shop.
[00:29:55] And they’re like, they just flowing. They’re not listening. They’re like way over there. But if you go and [00:30:00] set up your shop in the river and meet them where they’re at. And meet them at the cold and the warm and the hot, and you’ve got a strategy for each. That means you are intentionally and actively.
[00:30:14] Moving them through those stages, right? Mm-hmm. You’re not paying all your attention to getting new people in. Yeah. You’re not paying no attention to getting people in, but all your attention on the people that are already there, et cetera. So that would be my first thing would be get clear on at least one strategy for each, because that takes away all that shiny object syndrome.
[00:30:33] Yeah. It’s like, oh, I should have started an email list yesterday. Oh, oh, should I be on Pinterest? Oh, should I? You know, be on TikTok. Should I do this? Should I do that? Should I be here? Just one, at least one for each. When you nail that and you rinse it and repeat it and it’s working, then you can bring other stuff in.
[00:30:51] Yeah. And then the second part is I think we can get really tripped up with. First looking at all the things that [00:31:00] we wanna do in say a week. Like, I wanna do three reels and I wanna do one email newsletter, and I wanna do, I wanna do five posts Euro. Yeah. And then it’s like you are taking all those things and trying to shove it into whatever capacity you have that week.
[00:31:17] Yeah. And then of course it fails and you go, that sucked. I’ve sucked. You know, I, I, I’m never gonna get this right. Rather than looking at your capacity, which, especially as moms, that can change from day to day, week to week, how much available capacity you have and going, okay, this is my capacity for today, or this is my capacity for this week.
[00:31:42] What can I fit into that? So I prioritize? Yeah. For example, if I’m really pushed on time, I know for me that I prioritize. Stories, IG stories and my email newsletter, that is my top priority because that is where my [00:32:00] warm to hot audience is. They already know me. They already trust me. So that’s where my focus would be like prioritize, and then if I’ve got more time, then I add in more stuff.
[00:32:10] Lisa: Love that. That’s one thing. It’s funny ’cause we’ve been. On, on the hill of having an email list since, oh gosh, I think 2011, and we have not missed a weekly email with Milk QA since 2011. Yeah. Amazing. Amazing. I mean that my team, that’s my, me and my team. Yeah.
[00:32:30] Tania: Yeah.
[00:32:31] Lisa: But like who? Yeah. That’s a long time.
[00:32:35] That’s a long time. And yet I cannot, yeah. Two reels done in a week. Maybe we get one.
[00:32:41] Tania: Yeah. But it’s like, you know, that’s where it comes down to where is my best RIY, not just for money, but for time investment. Yeah. Yeah. Like, am I better to spend an hour. Crafting this amazing email newsletter that’s gonna go [00:33:00] out and it’s gonna hit people’s inboxes.
[00:33:02] Yeah. And they’re definitely gonna see it hit their inbox and you know, whatever your open rate is like, I know I’ve got a 20, 30, 50% open rate versus I spent an hour on a reel. That are designed to go to a wide audience rather than a deep one. Yeah. Even if you’re using hashtags and things to try and narrow it down, really, you just can’t control so much as to where that reel goes.
[00:33:28] Lisa: Yeah.
[00:33:29] Tania: It’s like, what is the better use of my hour? Yeah.
[00:33:33] Lisa: Yeah. So you know what I actually just heard recently, which I thought was really fascinating, is that reels that don’t have sound do way better. Because they, they have more potential to go viral because the majority on PE of people on Instagram and TikTok actually don’t speak English.
[00:33:51] And so if there’s no sound, it gets pushed out to more people. Wow. I was like, oh wow,
[00:33:58] that is a good nugget.
[00:33:59] Lisa: Wow.
[00:33:59] Tania: Oh [00:34:00] my gosh. That goes against everything everyone else is saying, right? I was like, about the trending audio and I know this and
[00:34:07] Lisa: that. Yeah. I was like, but that actually makes sense. I’m gonna try that.
[00:34:11] Yeah,
[00:34:11] Lisa: does, who knows. It may not work. I don’t even know. But that’s what I heard, so I thought that was interesting. That’s something to play with, and I think that’s the key though, is like play. Like just play with it. Don’t take it so darn seriously. Some things are gonna hit, some things aren’t, and that’s okay.
[00:34:26] Everybody, like we have things that, like, I think I spend like three hours on a reel and I’m thinking it’s gonna be amazing, and like 200 people see it. And then one I’d spend like eight seconds on with a trending audio goes viral. And you’re just like, ah, I don’t even know. Yeah.
[00:34:43] Tania: Yeah. And I’ve seen people do comparisons with the exact same thing on TikTok.
[00:34:47] Yes. Versus Instagram, how many people it reaches on, one, how many people it reaches on the other. It’s like, I don’t think there’s a really exact science here. Mm-hmm. I mean, we can do what we can do to help. [00:35:00] Yeah. Our chances, but yeah.
[00:35:03] Lisa: Oh, just is what it is. Yeah. Alright, so what’s one aha moment you’ve seen photographers have after working with you?
[00:35:12] Tania: I would say that they, they realize, or maybe remember that they actually have a voice, like they have things to say that people wanna hear. They have like so much more to offer than just their stunning photos. Yeah. And the sum of them is so much more than just their work. I think we can get really hung up on our art, that side of things, but when we try and couple that with words, we feel like, yeah, again, no one wants to listen to what I’ve got to say or I don’t have anything interesting to say, or I’m just [00:36:00] gonna sound like everyone else so I’m not gonna bother, or Yeah, all those things start cropping up and it’s like they realize that.
[00:36:09] W Again, when they start working on that excavation of those, particularly with the messaging, they realize, oh, huh, I do actually have things to say that make me feel excited about things again. And it’s, it actually is harder than what it sounds like. I mean, mm-hmm. I feel like a lot of the people I’ve worked with in different capacities, they go straight to that surface level stuff.
[00:36:34] And they find it really hard to move past that service level stuff. It’s like that client avatar that’s really surface level what everyone’s telling us to do kind of a thing. And we are wondering why it’s not working. It’s like going deeper is it’s the work, it’s the hard stuff. Yeah, it really is. So when they actually keep pushing past and getting below what their first answer [00:37:00] is to things.
[00:37:01] That’s when the real goals are to come out and they realize, oh, how I’ve been looking at things isn’t really serving me at all. Like how I’m looking at my ideal clients, what I’m thinking about, what they need to hear from me. It’s not that at all. It’s these other things. And then it all starts to kind of snowball from there.
[00:37:21] Lisa: Mm-hmm. I love that. What I’m really hearing is like, don’t be afraid to let people get to know you. Yeah. And I think that’s one thing that we really are, I know that’s not something I struggle with with both my companies is just. Letting people in. I think. Yeah. I think, I think I’m vulnerable and then I’m like, actually, am I right?
[00:37:37] I don’t
[00:37:38] Tania: know. Yeah. Yeah. But I think it, it ta I’ve heard, uh, a wonderful quote a long time ago, and I wish I could remember who said it, but. It was like humor and vulnerability are the currency of the internet. And I just think that’s so true. And it doesn’t, I think people get scared by the word vulnerability, [00:38:00] feeling like they have to show all their wounds or their scars.
[00:38:03] Mm-hmm. And you know, to be relatable, but it’s not that at all. And, uh, humor like. Wit such a big thing. Like the people that I talk to when I actually have conversations with people and then I read a post, it’s like, or I read their website copy and it’s like, you are not in there. Yes. Like, where are you?
[00:38:24] You have this amazing personality. You say the funniest things or you say the, the quirkiest things that people would love to hear and to see that, that side of you, but they, they aren’t letting people in.
[00:38:39] Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. So in your Signature program Curate and Grow, is this something that you help people with?
[00:38:45] And if so, can you share a little bit more about this program?
[00:38:48] Tania: Yeah, absolutely. So Curate and Grow, it started out as a group program. It’s currently being reimagined into a self-paced program, but basically it is [00:39:00] about brand leadership through your getting to know those big brand messages. Getting to know those conversations you wanna lead, but also, like we talked about, getting excited about your brand by looking at your offers and how you can talk about your offers in a way that has people going from, yeah, that sounds good.
[00:39:23] Maybe one day to, oh yeah, I can clearly see that that is for me and I need that sooner rather than later. So yeah, it’s a very big focus on the. Because I think a lot of people hear the word branding and they think visuals, they think logo, they think font, font selection. They think color palette. But no, this is the, this is the deep stuff.
[00:39:47] This is the stuff that leads to you having those words and not getting stuck in, I dunno what to say. So working on those big brand messages, working on that, getting all that stuff [00:40:00] out, working on how to talk about your offers, working out how to translate all of that. Practically to your content and to the copy on your website.
[00:40:10] Like your words are everywhere. They are literally everywhere. They’re in your emails, they’re in your stories, your posts, your opt-in pages, your, you know, on your website, on your lead magnet. They are everywhere and they are super, super important. Like if you imagine, say. You are on your stories and you’ve got a lead magnet that you wanna let people know about.
[00:40:34] So the words on your stories have got to lead them to clicking that link, and then they click the link and then they get your opt-in page for the lead magnet. And the words on that opt-in page have got to really encourage them to put their details in and then they put their details in and then the subject line of your welcome email.
[00:40:54] Has gotta encourage them to open it. So it is like at every stage of leading people deeper [00:41:00] and deeper into your business, it is your words. Of course, your work is incredibly important, but it’s your words to back it up.
[00:41:07] Lisa: Mm-hmm.
[00:41:08] Tania: Yeah,
[00:41:08] Lisa: I love that. I love that. Sounds like an incredible program. So you have a wait list going for that right now, is that true?
[00:41:17] I do, yes. Yeah. Awesome. Awesome. So I’ll make sure that we include that in the show notes as well. Yeah. So are you ready for a lightning round? Oh yes. Okay. What’s your go-to? Coffee or tea order? Coffee
[00:41:31] Tania: order. That would be a latte?
[00:41:33] Lisa: Mm-hmm. Me too. Yeah. Yeah. If you weren’t doing this work, what would your alternate dream job be?
[00:41:40] Tania: I would love to have a. Bookshop, like, uh, Notting Hill kind of vibes. Oh, yes. Like a little bookstore where I can just chill and talk to people and talk about books
[00:41:54] Lisa: and yeah, that’d be fun. I love it. I’d wanna have a tea house with like, oh, costuming, like a Victorian [00:42:00] tea house with like, just tea parties all day long.
[00:42:02] Tania: Oh wow.
[00:42:04] Lisa: Yes. I
[00:42:05] Tania: love that.
[00:42:06] Lisa: I love it. I’m such a geek. I love it. Okay, so what’s a piece of content you’ve created that still makes you proud? Yeah, that
[00:42:16] Tania: would be, I did a post. It makes me proud because it was the first post I did, it was on Instagram and, and I think I changed it, repurposed it to an email, but it was the first one where I got brave enough to actually.
[00:42:30] Call out those big messages that I had been wanting to say. Uh, I think the first, it was a carousel and the first slide was everybody’s talking about six figure businesses. And then the rest of it goes on to say, but no one’s talking about, you know, but you are just kind of, but you are just trying to struggle to get one booking this month.
[00:42:48] You know? It’s like that was the first time and, and it did well because people were like, yeah, thank you for saying the thing that we were thinking, but no one’s actually saying it.
[00:42:59] Lisa: [00:43:00] Yeah. I love that. What’s your guilty pleasure TV show or binge series?
[00:43:05] Tania: Yeah, so I would say anything, I couldn’t think of something in particular because it always changes what’s on Netflix or whatever, but anything crime thriller, like I, when the blacklist was on, I, I loved that.
[00:43:17] I watched all, I Ate Seasons, I think it was. So yeah, anything like that.
[00:43:22] Lisa: Love it. If your brand had a signature scent, what would, what would it be?
[00:43:28] Tania: Yeah, something like Joe Malone. Um, I think it’s called Beach Blossom. Yeah, something, something Ocean beachy, sea salt related. Love it.
[00:43:41] Lisa: Okay. You get to have dinner with three people, dead or alive, who’s at your table?
[00:43:45] So these are all people I love to follow
[00:43:47] Tania: on Instagram. Beth from Baby Mac, she’s on Instagram and she has like a homeware store and, but she’s just so relatable. And I would choose Emily Burla, who is the [00:44:00] founder of um, the clothing label Bohemian traders and Marisa 20 Men who is from Dirty copy. So copywriting.
[00:44:10] Yeah, so I’m currently just about finished. I was doing a copywriting course with her ’cause I now offer that in my business. And yeah, she’s so funny. Hilarious.
[00:44:21] Lisa: I love that. That sounds like a fun dinner. Yeah. Because
[00:44:24] Tania: you learn that.
[00:44:26] Lisa: Okay. What’s one song that always boosts your mood?
[00:44:30] Tania: Yeah, I would say I like to pick songs that have, like that you can really.
[00:44:36] Belt out when you’re making dinner or something. So Cornflake girl, but the Florence and the machine version.
[00:44:44] Lisa: Oh, I don’t know it. I’m gonna have to check out. Yeah, yeah. Okay. So where is the best place for our listeners to connect with you and join the wait list for your program?
[00:44:54] Tania: Yeah, so if they go to soulful story [00:45:00] co.com/programs on there, there will be, it’s.
[00:45:03] There’s the link to the Curate and Grow wait list. Um, there’s also a link to the social set that we talked about earlier, but yeah, the wait list will curate and grow. You’ll find it there. Awesome.
[00:45:15] Lisa: Alright, well I love to end my interviews just with this last question and it is, what are you currently curious about or artistically curious about?
[00:45:23] Tania: Yeah, so I am currently curious about just. Simplifying in life in general because like I said, my kids are 14 and 12 and just making sure that I’m not sleepwalking through life and because it’s really, really easy to do. You know, days turn into weeks and weeks turn into months and next thing you know they’re leaving home.
[00:45:48] So yeah, just being really intentional and noticing and making opportunities for us as a family to. To do things together while my kids are still [00:46:00] talking to me. So yeah, just kind of loving these golden days while they’re still here. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:46:08] Lisa: These middle years. I know. Yeah. Yeah, I know. Like what? 16 summers if we’re lucky.
[00:46:13] And my son’s gonna be 16 this year and Yeah. Yeah. Thinking about getting a job and,
[00:46:19] oh yeah.
[00:46:19] Lisa: It went by so fast and I didn’t realize how quickly it was gonna be, so, yeah. Absolutely. Thank you so much for joining me today. It’s just been an absolute treat talking to you. Thank you so much, Lisa. I’ve really loved it.
[00:46:34] It was a lot of fun, all my beautiful friends. I hope you have loved this conversation just as much as I have. I am sending you so much of my light and my love today and every single day. We will see you next time.
